Tim Taylor

Pascal's wager simply says that belief in the Christian God is safer than

nonbelief. If nonbelievers are wrong, they go to hell. If believers are wrong,

they simply die like everyone else.

The obvious problem is that there are many religious belief systems, not just

Christianity.

Philospher Doug Krueger explains it better than I can. This is from a post of

his on Farrell Till's errancy list.

David Lim : It is one against all. Never is it one against another. The same contention as in the days of Abraham, Jacob, Ruth, Samson, Moses, Joshua, David, Peter and Paul.

Not all will/would see that clearly. Just as Paul arguing in Athens. Many turned away. But those who are pre-destined to be saved embraced the doctrine and faith. It is argument on the surface; and God's work in the hearts.

=======

DOUG

Pascal's Wager has many problems, but one of the main ones is this. Pascal

advocated believing in god as a safety precaution, just in case god exists.

It is not intended as a proof of god's existence. In fact, Pascal bases his

wager on the fact that reason cannot decide the issue of god's existence.

David Lim : Is this really acknowledged as a "fact"? So it is understood that - reason cannot decide the issue of god's existence. The position of Atheists is removed.

The Historical background and environment of Pascal's time is that The Biblical God is experienced and can be experienced. It was not an unknown. Neither is it unknowable.

In fact even Modern Christians advocate that the Christian God is personal and knowable. He is a person, a character. The Trinity is a personality and communicable.

So, suggests Pascal, you should believe so you can be safe, just in case god

exists. But to know what belief will be "safe," you must already know what

god wants. But if you don't know that god exists, there is no way to show

what he wants, so you don't know that believing in, say, the xian god is a

safer bet than believing in the Mayan god. Suppose the "real" god is an

Olmec god who doesn't mind atheists but hates those who worship false gods

such as YHWH. Then believing in the god of the bible is not safer than being

an atheist or an agnostic.

David Lim : This idea of "being saved" is a Christian one. It is not just some sort of "playing safe". It is attainable in the time of Pascal and our time what YHWH God wants and what other gods want. Anyone can make a choice on the belief systems.

There is a difference between "not wanting to know" and "cannot know". There is no effort expressed in trying to know and find out in this anti-Christian argument.

The Mayan god does not promise or advocate Paradise/Heaven with the Almighty. Not all promise Divine unity. Even Islam does not advocate that.

Supposition shows no effort in finding out the truth.

Pascal did not suppose YHWH, the reality of his time.

Unless you can show that a god exists and wants you to believe x, there is no

way to know what beliefs are "safer" than others. But if you could prove

that god exists and wants you to believe X, then you don't need the wager in

the first place because you can just use the proof.

Pasal's Wager is a failure.

David Lim : As it was in the beginning that Abraham believed God YHWH even when all others worship something else.

Believing in other gods simply would not get anyone into Heaven of the jealous Almighty God and be in loving unity with Him.

It is not a matter of believing is there is a way, a knowable way. It is recorded that the snake of Aaron's staff swallowed other snakes of Egyptian magic; yet Egyptians did not change religion and turn to YHWH. Moses brought the plagues and Egyptian worship system remained the same.

The Prophet Samuel contended with the prophets of Baal; and those with Baal were still with Baal. Hannibel is still Hannibel in history.

Jesus told of the story that even if Lazarus came back to life, people would not turn from their positions if they reject Moses and the Prophets.

Jesus rose from the death; and the majority of secular record did not want to express and celebrate that.

There are ample example in Scriptures demonstrating non-believers turning from YHWH even when there is sufficient evidence and persuasion.

The large boat in the region of Ararat voiced of the Global flood. Yet do you believe?

The chariot wheel at the bottom of the Red Sea voiced of the Exodus. Yet do you believe?

The outward falling wall of Jericho voiced of miraculous structural collapse. Yet do you believe?

The recapturing of Jerusalem by flying over it voiced of Divine Revelation. Yet do you believe?

The return of the Jewish people and formation of the Jewish State suddenly with Jewish culture, language and customs voiced of Divine revelation coming true. Yet do you believe?

No way of knowing? Or just intention to avoid encountering?

Would you struggle with God? Would you be Yisrael?